Curse

Lialith · Jun 17, 2012, 08:49 AM // 08:49

hello there,

once long ago i played GW and came back now to play nightfall, eye of the north, and to build up my hall of monuments.

now my problem is: i'm like a total noob,

never really played PvP and i am not familiar with most of the available skills. (there are SO many of them!) i had quite a hard time completing the nightfall campain just now, wile i hear most of players have no trouble to go solo even through heroic areas accompanyed by their 7 heros.

so what i am looking for is a 7 hero meta build for my nekro, capable to manage most of the areas. cause i'm realy tired of dying and failing over and over again at quests like clensing shenzun tunnels where i can't even get past the first enemy group. :/ my hero group also just fell apart at the very first underworld enemys. an other player helped me then, just took out his heros and cleaned the underworld for me to get to the spider. thats demotivating. :/

so if you could help me find a decent 7 hero meta build, that would be great!

as of now i have these heros (havent played eye of the north much jet):
3x W, 3x R, 3x Mo, 2x N, 2x Me, 3x E, 1x A, 1x Rt, 1x P, 3x D

for the moment i play my necro as minion master and take a hero necro along with me for the support. (he kills himself quite often though ^^)

Player N: Hexe's Vigor, Putrid Bile, Animate Bone Fiend, Ebon Battle Standard of Honor, Order of Undeath, Blood of the Master, Verata's Sacrifice, Masochism
Hero N: Mark of Pain, Barbs, Weaken Armor, Plague Sending, Foul Feast, Blood Bond, Blood is Power

i like playing a MM, but any build for my own character to fit the new hero group build would be perfectly fine! so if you could tell me a decent hero build that works well with a nekro as a player character, i could go and get the needed skills and missing heros to build it!

and i think that would help me a lot.

Darkicon · Jun 17, 2012, 08:55 AM // 08:55

For awhile I was using the 7 Hero Player Support build at PvX:

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_7_Hero_Player_Support

It's a pretty good build, able to clear through just about anything easily, including UW.

Lialith · Jun 17, 2012, 09:04 AM // 09:04

looks doable at first sight.

but what skills do i take with my character? since the one necro is a minion bomber i cant go as a MM.

enter_the_zone · Jun 17, 2012, 09:16 AM // 09:16

This works especially well on a necro because the e-mgmt is insane..

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_3_Hero_Discordway

Just fill in the other spots with Rits and Mesmers from the build in the post above. I'd also tweak the necro builds to be a bit more aggressive if you're using 7 heroes.

And, depending on the area, you might want to replace the SoGM rit from the 7 hero build with the ST prot rit

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Rt/any_Soul_Twisting_Hero

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lialith

looks doable at first sight.

but what skills do i take with my character? since the one necro is a minion bomber i cant go as a MM.

Most places have enough corpses that you can have 2 MM's. Otherwise, I'd tend to run this

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:N/A_Mark_of_Pain_Nuker, with enfeebling blood

Frangeo Munda · Jun 17, 2012, 03:08 PM // 15:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by enter_the_zone

Most places have enough corpses that you can have 2 MM's. Otherwise, I'd tend to run this

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:N/A_Mark_of_Pain_Nuker, with enfeebling blood

I'd just want to note that this DOES restrict your build to having an assassin secondary. That's fine usually, but you may wanna consider other feeder hexes for Discordway (see below).
Quick note: I'm not on my home Computer right now, so I'm salvaging the builds from GWPvX.
Ok, looking at your hero list, there's a two missing that might halp you: one necro and one rit. I'll assume, for the sake of argument, that you have gotten Razah (the rit hero from the end of NF), and not Xandra (the rit hero from EotN). Second, I would guess that you have not obtained Livia (N hero from EotN) I mention this because, quite frankly, necro and rit heroes are utterly pwn in pve. See if you can get these heroes: if not, PM me @ Portable Healy Unit and I'll provide healyservices.
I personally find running an MM on my character (i.e., not a hero) very boring, so see if you can relegate that to a hero. Heros are also quite good at managing minion support skills like Death Nova, so there's that too.
I recently completed yet another GWAMM on my Moldy Unit, and I pretty much ran one (brand of) build the entire time: an Icy Veins nuker with Discordway. As enter_the_zone mentioned, discordway is pretty much the meta for everything pve. However, it requires a quickly renewable hex and condition to work. IV works great here, as not only does it recharge quickly, but it also does damage on target's death (speeding up your kill rate). Skilling these heroes also isn't too nasty, since they all use the same elite (Discord, cap-able in Factions)
Now, what about your other heroes? Let's talk about rits. Rits are wonderful with their native spirit-wrangling abilities. Rangers can manipulate spirits somewhat, and there's one profession-independent skill, but only rits can really do as much with creating, maintaining, using, and destroying spirits. As such, I usually bring two rits:
First is an SoS/Resto rit (OACjEqiMJOXzyJGzbyMlmTuhJ is the build). This, along with the MM and heals from discord, completely replaces any monks. Poor monks. Please don't forget to feed your monks; they need love too.
My second rit is the ST rit, or as I call it, the "my monk is bored" build: OACiAyk8gNtePuwJAAA4MBAA. This build reduces incoming damage to very manageable levels (no nasty 600-hp HM spikes!). Remember that the spirits themselves are NOT under their own effects (i.e., Shelter and Union can lose more than 10% hp per hit), so it's often a good idea to watch where your hero is plopping these down. The optionals here can be energy management (Signet of Creation, mez interrupts, etc), more utility, or speed boost.
I'll finish with the final 2 heroes (Panic mez and Inept or Psychic Instability mez) later.

Markaedw · Jun 17, 2012, 03:32 PM // 15:32

I used the 7 hero markway build to complete almost all of WoC in both hard mode and easy mode

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_7_Hero_Markway

I did switch to discordway for the final boss fight.

I also used a regular MM build for the 2 quests where I needed to lure vital NPCs away, but if you go that way, make sure you bring skills to kill minions because the NPC healers will follow you back into battle.

HigherMinion · Jun 17, 2012, 05:55 PM // 17:55

I'm a massive advocator of Markway. It works best when you micro splinter on both dervs, but the mobs go down soo fast you'll think you're FoWSCing. Part of the theory of kill before you get killed, really.

To compare Discord with Markway;Discord is a caster cluster team so AoE damage will screw you faster. Condition removal can potentially kill your damage (Shiverpeak Centaurs did that to me quite often) You also only have two sources of AoE damage yourself (Putrid Bile, Death Nova) apart from Mark of Pain which is only triggered by spears and minions. Not good enough when minions don't focus.

On the other hand, Markway gives your AP-MoP hexes purpose and 100x more damage capability. The great thing is you lose no single-target damage because scythes train for a lot.

But for areas where it doesn't work so well, just slap 3 mesmers and an ST rit and cspace through PvE.

Lialith · Jun 17, 2012, 07:08 PM // 19:08

thank you alot so far guys!!
i just got my two missing heroes, razah and livia

(getting the razah quest done was quite hard with my current hero setup...), now lets see what skills i dont have jet.

(probably all the ritu skills :/)

Sethellington · Jun 17, 2012, 07:59 PM // 19:59

I got bored of my usual team set up so I tried something new today... I ran this:

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:N/Me_Feve...ms_Necromancer

and my hero team build was based around this:

http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_SFway

except take out the Fevered Dreams mes hero, since you're playing this. Then replace it with an Ineptitude mes. So all in all you have:

You N/Me FD
E/P SF
E/P SF
Rit/ SoS
Me/ Panic
Me/ Ineptitude
N/Rt Healer
N/Mo Minion Bomber Protter

If possible, wait for a mob to ball up. Cast FD on one of the central foes, then follow immediately with YMLAD! to snare them all. By this point one of your eles will have cast SF, meaning the whole mob is crippled, on fire and dazed. From here they go down in no time. Use FH! on the foe you originally targeted to get Deep Wound on the entire mob. The pressure is huge with mass blind, weakness, degen, daze, DW and a lot of direct damage. I was amazed at the survivability of the whole thing as well. Have a go, see what you think.

Lialith · Jun 17, 2012, 09:52 PM // 21:52

that sounds like a realy funn to play build sethellington! ^^

i spend my evening trying to customize your suggestions so far.
thats what i came up with.

please let me know what you think!
(didn't try it out, cause i dont have many of those skills yet. ^^)

N (Player, IV): OABBcBVzUHoAuFGTeDaT2WC
N/P (MB): OAlBYBFzcUhGsFmUpAWjtjB
N/Rt (Discord Heal): OAhAMxM7AiQaO5GmU7LG
N/Mo (MB Prot): OANB8CFzUFgGsF2ScXVPEQA
M/Rt (Dom): OQhAM0gpnpLHMEyAL/LG
M/Rt (Illu): OQhAQvArA5ZIgkAZALfXM
Rt (SoS): OACAMXzyJGTaO5GmMTvJ
Rt/M (Spirit Spamer): OAWAMYTr3jLc6MzA9gRI

Premium Unleaded · Jun 17, 2012, 10:27 PM // 22:27

ST is useless with minions because they're going to eat up the spirits faster than discord's rc.

Sethellington · Jun 17, 2012, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Yeah ST will fall immediately with minions - pick one or the other. Also, your team focusses very much on killing 1 enemy at a time (Discord, Necrosis, YMLAD!, FH! etc.). Meta shifted a long time ago from things like Discordway to doing a lot of damage AoE instead. The skills readily exist (ESurge, SF, Ineptitude, MoP the list goes on and on). Discordway works, but it's a lot slower killing 1 enemy at a time than 1 mob at a time and taking out the odd survivor if you see what I mean?

Lialith · Jun 18, 2012, 08:21 AM // 08:21

sorry i am not familiar with ritus, why does ST not work with Minions?

Rushin Roulette · Jun 18, 2012, 08:35 AM // 08:35

Soul Twisting itself is not the problem, but the spirits needed in the build loose Health every time they have to heal or reduce damage from any party member or ally. Now picture what happens if you have 8 party members plus 15-30 small mininons with health degen running around? Yup. its like trying to organize a snowball fight in Death Valley or the sahara desert

.

Lialith · Jun 18, 2012, 08:53 AM // 08:53

ok, i understand... but i would prefere Discord over Markway because in a hard fight the hero group can last longer? ... but if i cant use the prot ritu, what would you suggest to put in instead?

aspi · Jun 18, 2012, 09:01 AM // 09:01

Hi Lialith, just one thing for general PVE, AOE spells and skills are far superior over single target damage. You cannot compare general discordway(it does work in almost the entire game) to an exploding aoe like markway. Markway will mop the floor with most if not all content, while discord is slow but steady work.
I am not sure why this markway build has a lower score on pvx...

Lialith · Jun 18, 2012, 10:40 AM // 10:40

so basicly you say that this is a good way to go?

:
http://www.gwpvx.com/Build:Team_-_7_Hero_Markway
thank you guys so far! i will try to setup my heros in that way.

HigherMinion · Jun 18, 2012, 10:53 AM // 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by aspi

I am not sure why this markway build has a lower score on pvx...

I can answer that: There is a voter on the build who doesn't trust physicals, and downvotes any build with them in. Bit of a bugger, since it's the best necro-specific hero team.

Sethellington · Jun 18, 2012, 12:34 PM // 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

I can answer that: There is a voter on the build who doesn't trust physicals, and downvotes any build with them in. Bit of a bugger, since it's the best necro-specific hero team.

I've yet to try it but I will for sure. Have a look at what I posted a few comments above. Try it out and see what you think. It's about as efficient as I've seen a team with a Nec primary. Seems to tick all the boxes. Will try Markway too and see what happens.

Daesu · Jun 18, 2012, 03:47 PM // 15:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by HigherMinion

I can answer that: There is a voter on the build who doesn't trust physicals, and downvotes any build with them in. Bit of a bugger, since it's the best necro-specific hero team.

That is probably the general distrust of melee heroes AI that we have all come to accept. Melee heroes sometimes run around doing nothing in the middle of an AoE, sometimes they get stuck, etc.

Personally, I would replace the dervishes with mesmers and just use spears on my casters to trigger MoP. But if I don't have mercs, I would replace them with a mesmer and necro.